Robert BOGG Jnr [16756]

  General Notes:

Robert was a shoemaker who travelled to Sydney in 1814 on the Broxbornebury aged 15 with his mother and siblings. He returned to England leaving Sydney on the Venerable 19 Apr 1823. He paid his passage of two pounds fifteen shillings This is recorded in the NSW State Records 4/4774, Reel 562. COD No. 421.

He met and "married" Mary and they had two children born in England. Robert returned to Australia on board the "Boddington" in April 1828. The Bogg family story is that he worked his passage arriving with one shilling. The "Boddington" arrived in Sydney Cove on 22nd April 1828, under Captain J. R. Taylor.

A NSW Census in 1828 placed Robert and his family as:
B1501. Robert Bogg, F28, Came Free, Ship "Boddington", Arrival 1828, Regligion
P., Occupation Shoemaker. Residence Phillip Street, Sydney.
B1502. Mary Bogg, F26, Came Free, Ship "Alexander Henry", Arrival 1828, Religion P.
B1503. Hannah Bogg, 3 years, Came Free, Ship "Alexander Henry", Arrival 1828.
B1504. Francis Bogg, 2 years, Came Free, Ship "Alexander Henry", Arrival 1828.
Note. The ages as given are uncertain

In 1832 Robert was working on his own account in York St Sydney.

On 24th June 1836 Robert Bogg Jnr. and his wife Mary Bogg were charged before
the Sydney Police Court with stealing "one tame fowl" the property of Thomas
Hely and committed for Trial at the Sydney Court of Quarter Sessions on 12th
July 1836. The Court Record shows the following:
"On Oath, Mr. Joseph Nobbs, him residing in York Street, being sworn deposeth and saith -
Yesterday as I stood at my gate I saw the prisoner Bogg.........a Cock from the...........
.......( not legible)........He came to me and asked me if it was mine, I told him that it was not
and he then said that I could have it if it was, he then took the Cock away with him and when
I saw Mr. Hely looking for the Cock, I told him what I had seen.
The female person was in the company of the male prisoner. They both had hold of the
Cock and the Cock's legs were tied.
Signed Joseph Nobbs. Sworn the 24th June 1836 before W. Wilson.

24th June 1836
Robert Bogg, Free
& Mary Bogg, Free
Sydney
Thomas Heley......in the Sydney.......being sworn Deposeth and saith - I missed a Cock,
my property, out of .....yard yesterday. I was informed that a man had been seen ......
a Cock from the.........and after doing so that he carried it away with him. I went in pursuit
of the man and found him near a Public House and the man's wife was with him and had
the Cock concealed under her apron. I demanded the Cock but the prisoner who is this
man, refused to give the Cock up to me. The prisoner's wife ......to persuade him to give it
up. I believe that my son tied the legs of the Cock in order to prevent him leaving the yard.
The prisoner did say that he would deliver up the Cock if I made an affidavit that it not..(?)
mine. He said that after I found the female person Bogg - the woman that was with him.
The value of the Cock is three shillings. Thos. Hely X his mark

COMMITTED FOR TRIAL.
12th July 1836
In the Court of Quarter Sessions
New South Wales to wit
Be it remembered that John Hubert Plunkett Esq., His Majesty's Attorney Gereral
for the Colony of New South Wales, who prosecutes for His Majesty in his behalf,
being present in the Court of General Quarter Sessions of the Peace now here on
the 12th day of July in the year of Our Lord one thousand eight hundred and thirty
six at Sydney in the said Colony, informs the said Court that-
Robert Bogg, late of Sydney in the said Colony of New South Wales, Labourer
and Mary Bogg of the same place, seamstress-
On the twenty third day of June in the Year of Our Lord one thousand eight
hundred and thirty six at Sydney aforesaid in the Colony aforesaid
one tame fowl of the value of three shillings of the Goods and Chattels of Thomas Hely
Then and there being found feloniously did steal, take, and carry away, against the Peace of Our Lord the King, His Crown and Dignity, and against the form of the Statute, in such Case made and provided.
Sydney Quarter Sessions.
Tried 12th July 1836 by a Civil Jury
VERDICT - Not Guilty

The Sydney Gazette on Tuesday 9th July 1839 contained the following article:-
Monday
8th July 1839, before the Chairman and Civil Jury Robert Bogg was indicted for embezzlement.
The prisoner, who is a shoemaker, was entrusted with some work to perform by Mr. Slowman,
which he was charged with embezzling. Pleaded Guilty:
Three calender months to the house of correction.

Robert Bogg and Mary Bogg appear to have separated at some point after 1836. This was not the first time as evidenced by the following notice in the Sydney Gazette on Thursday 29th March 1832
CAUTION.
WHEREAS my Wife, Mary Bogg,
has left her home without any just cause or provocation, I hereby caution the Public against giving any trust or credit on my account.
ROBERT BOGG,
Bootmaker.

Between 1836 and 1850 Robert and his sons Francis and John moved to the Sutton Forest Area near Berrima, with a postal address of Robert Bogg Post Office Berrima on 8 Dec 1848, Sutton Forrest on 30 Apr 1850, Berrima on 30 Sep 1850
In 1863 he received a land grant at Big Hill Marulan NSW, but he remained a bootmaker all his life.
Ref: D Becker

  Research Notes:

Robert Bogg and Robert Howden [25443] are very likely to be one and the same person.

  Other Records

1. Detailed Family History of James Bogg Jnr.: Researched by David Becker Family Historian: Australia.
30 May 2013 Family Group Sheet
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Husband: Robert BOGG #6207 died at age: 76
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Born: c1799 in Lincolnshire, England
Died: 30 Apr 1875 in Bridgey Swamp, Big Hill, Arthursleigh, Marulan,NSW 1,2
Buried: 3 May 1875 in Church of England Cemetery Marulan NSW 3
Occupation: Shoemaker
Father: Robert BOGG #6208
Mother: Mary BOGG #6209
Robert Bogg (Jnr) originally travelled to Australia aboard the "Broxbornebury"
in the company of his mother Mary Bogg and 5 other siblings. He was aged about
15 years at the time of his journey. Mary was joining her husband in New South
Wales after he was transported several months earlier aboard the "General
Hewitt" under sentence of fourteen years hard labour.

The "Broxbornebury" left Portsmith England before daylight on 22nd February
1814 bound for Sydney Cove in the Colony of New South Wales, it's first and
only voyage to the colony. The ship called into the Spanish port of La Corunna
Island on 3rd March 1814 and on 15th March they made anchorage in Funchal,
the capital of Madeira Islands, a Portugese property, west of Morocco, off the
West Coast of Africa. After taking on supplies the ship sailed for Sydney and
arrived four months later without touching port in any other country. The
vessel was commanded by the owner Captain Thomas Pitcher Jnr. (1) with a crew
of seventy. Aboard were one hundred and twenty female convicts (some with
children); twenty eight free families, mostly comprised of women with children
whose husbands were convicts serving life sentences and previously transported
to the Colony; and several well-to-do passengers. The ship had been hired by
the English Authorities (2) and the Surgeon for the journey was Doctor Colin
McLachlan.(3) Originally it had been planned to banish one hundred and ninety
convicts as well as the others from the "Emu". (4) The average age of the
convicts was twenty-nine years and half of those had been tried in London.

The "Broxbornebury" was British built, weighing seven hundred and fifty tons
and was protected by fourteen guns.(5) First stop for the Broxbornebury was
on the 3rd of March at the Spanish port of La Corunna Island.(6) This area had
been formerly settled by the Romans in the 1st century, later ruled by the
Moors and the Portuguese before being annexed to Spain in the 15th century.
Captain Pitcher had to have the ship repaired after they encountered a storm
at sea two days before. Fresh provisions were bought and the prisoners and
free settlers bedding was aired after becoming wet. The women convicts would
have certainly kept below decks while they were anchored but not kept in
chains, as were male convicts on other voyages. They stayed here for six days
until the 9th of March. On the 15th they made anchorage in Funchal, the
capital of the Madeira Islands (7) which was a Portuguese property since the
year 1420 and was situated six hundred and forty five kms. west of Morocco,
off the West Coast of Africa. Famous for it's wine, four days were spent
there, again loading fresh stores and water. This was to be the last stop
until they reached dry land in Sydney four months later. For the full facts of
the voyage see notes on Mary Bogg (mother).
Ref. Journey to a New Life written by Elizabeth Hook. 1/15A Phyllis Street,
Minto NSW 2566. Published 2000.

The "Broxbornebury" sailed into Port Jackson in the evening of 27th July
1814. It is assumed Robert (Jnr) joined his father in the trade of shoe making
as his occupation in the 1828 census is that of Shoemaker. In 1819 his mother
Mary died.

"Robert left Sydney alone on board the "Venerable" on 19th April 1823, paying
a passage of two pounds fifteen shillings to return to England.
Ref.State Records 4/4774, Reel 562. COD No. 421. The passenger list records
him as the son of Robert Bogg, Elizabeth Street Sydney.

The following advertisement appeared in the Sydney Gazette on Thursday 10th April 1823:

"Robert Bogg, Jnr, leaving the Colony in the Ship Venerable, requests all claims
to be presented."

He met and "married" Mary and they had two children born in England, Frances
c1825 and Hannah c1826. According to the 1828 Census Hannah was the elder
child. Marriage entry not located at this stage.

Robert returned to Australia on board the "Boddington" in April 1828. The Bogg
family story is that he worked his passage arriving with one shilling. The
"Boddington" arrived in Sydney Cove on 22nd April 1828, the Commander's name
was J. R. Taylor, the tonnage was 301 tons and was built in London. The ship
sailed with a crew of 14 from London on 4th October 1827, arrived Cape of Good
Hope on 17th January, Hobart Town on 15th April, and thence to Sydney Cove.
The passenger list consisted of William Daws Esq., Mrs Foster, 3 children and
servant, I. Foster Esq., Dr. and Mrs Grover, Mr. I.D. Shelley, Mr. and Mrs
Simpson and three children, together with 10 steerage passengers. The names of
the crew members and the steerage passengers are not recorded. The ship also
carried 500 sheep aboard.
Ref. 4/5198, 4/5202, Reel 1263. Report on Arrivals - Addressed to Honorable
Colonial Secretary and signed James Raymond, Surveyor of Customs.

The Sydney Monitor dated 22 April 1828 contained the following entry:-

"Shipping Intelligence
Arrived yesterday, the ship Boddington, Capt. R Taylor, from London 4th
October, the Cape of Good Hope the 17th January, and Hobart Town the 15th
instant. Lading, sundries, and 500 sheep; the latter were taken on board at
the Derwent. Passengers, W. Dawes Esq. Dr Grover and Lady, the Lady of J.
Foster, Esq. and family, Mr J.H. Beauchard, Mr Shelly, Mr Simpson and family,
besides 10 steerage passengers."

Robert's wife Mary and their children left a month later as free passengers
on the the ship "Alexander Henry". Again the names of the steerage passengers
were not included in the ships record. (see details of journey under
Mary/Toucher/Howden/Woolsgrove)

The Sydney Monitor 17 May 1828 contained the following:-
"Alexander Henry". This vessel chartered by Mr. Levey, has brought us papers,
to the 3rd of December inclusive. A number of cabin and steerage passengers
have arrived by her She brings a great quantity of spirits and porter. She
spoke with a large ship off the coast, making her way for this port.. The
following we extract from the Times of the 3rd. of December, and the Atlas of
the same data. She left London the 3rd. of Dec. and Cork the 10th."

This ship left 2 months after the Boddington and arrived 25 days later than it.

Robert Bogg (Junior) appears with his wife Mary Bogg and children in the 1828 Census as follows:

B1501. Robert Bogg, F28, Came Free, Ship "Boddington", Arrival 1828, Regligion
P., Occupation Shoemaker. Residence Phillip Street, Sydney.
B1502. Mary Bogg, F26, Came Free, Ship "Alexander Henry", Arrival 1828, Religion P.
B1503. Hannah Bogg, 3 years, Came Free, Ship "Alexander Henry", Arrival 1828.
B1504. Frances Bogg, 2 years, Came Free, Ship "Alexander Henry", Arrival 1828.
Note. The ages are as given in the written record, but they could be reversed in error.

Robert and Mary had another son John born c1830, and female child named Sarah
which apparently died as the next daughter born was also named Sarah, neither
of these two children appear to have been Baptised. Two other daughters were
born to Robert and Mary, Sarah born 1833 and Eliza Elizabeth born 1835. These
two children were baptised in 1839.

In 1832 Robert Bogg worked in his own business in York Street.

On 24th June 1836 Robert Bogg Jnr. and his wife Mary Bogg were charged before
the Sydney Police Court with stealing "one tame fowl" the property of Thomas
Hely and committed for Trial at the Sydney Court of Quarter Sessions on 12th
July 1836. The Court Record shows the following:

"On Oath, Mr. Joseph Nobbs, him residing in York Street, being sworn deposeth and saith -
Yesterday as I stood at my gate I saw the prisoner Bogg.........a Cock from the...........
.......( not legible)........He came to me and asked me if it was mine, I told him that it was not
and he then said that I could have it if it was, he then took the Cock away with him and when
I saw Mr. Hely looking for the Cock, I told him what I had seen.
The female person was in the company of the male prisoner. They both had hold of the
Cock and the Cock's legs were tied.

signed Joseph Nobbs.

Sworn the 24th June 1836
before
W. Wilson.


24th June 1836
Robert Bogg, Free
& Mary Bogg, Free

Sydney

Thomas Heley......in the Sydney.......being sworn Deposeth and saith - I missed a Cock,
my property, out of .....yard yesterday. I was informed that a man had been seen ......
a Cock from the.........and after doing so that he carried it away with him. I went in pursuit
of the man and found him near a Public House and the man's wife was with him and had
the Cock concealed under her apron. I demanded the Cock but the prisoner who is this
man, refused to give the Cock up to me. The prisoner's wife ......to persuade him to give it
up. I believe that my son tied the legs of the Cock in order to prevent him leaving the yard.
The prisoner did say that he would deliver up the Cock if I made an affidavit that it not..(?)
mine. He said that after I found the female person Bogg - the woman that was with him.
The value of the Cock is three shillings.

Thos. Hely
X his mark
Sworn the 24th June 1836
before
W. Wilson.

COMMITTED FOR TRIAL.
12th July 1836
In the Court of Quarter Sessions
New South Wales to wit

Be it remembered that John Hubert Plunkett Esq., His Majesty's Attorney Gereral
for the Colony of New South Wales, who prosecutes for His Majesty in his behalf,
being present in the Court of General Quarter Sessions of the Peace now here on
the 12th day of July in the year of Our Lord one thousand eight hundred and thirty
six at Sydney in the said Colony, informs the said Court that

Robert Bogg, late of Sydney in the said Colony of New South Wales, Labourer
and
Mary Bogg of the same place, seamstress-

On the twenty third day of June in the Year of Our Lord one thousand eight
hundred and thirty six at Sydney aforesaid in the Colony aforesaid
one tame fowl
of the value of three shillings of the Goods and Chattels of Thomas Hely

Then and there being found feloniously did steal, take, and carry away,
against the Peace of Our Lord the King, His Crown and Dignity, and against
the form of the Statute, in such Case made and provided.

Sydney Quarter Sessions.
Tried 12th July 1836 by a Civil Jury

VERDICT - Not Guilty

The King on the prosecution of Thomas Hely


against Robert Bogg
Mary Bogg

Information for a Larceny
Witness Thomas Hely
Joseph Nobbs."


The following appeared in the "Commercial Journal" newspaper on 27th April 1839, page 2.

"POLICE INCIDENTS

Robert Bogg was given into the custody of constable Connell, by Mr Brain of
George-street, for drunkenness, and stated that there was a warrant out for
his apprehension.
Mr. Sloman of Pitt-street, by whom the warrant was taken out appeared, and on oath stated:-
I entrusted the prisoner with a pair of lasts and upper-leathers on Thursday
last, which he was to bring back in a few days; as they did not come in time.
I went to his lodgings, where I saw his tools, but no sign of my property. I
had heard something about the matter, which made me apply for a search warrant
for the premises of Brain; and while on his premises, he said, if you tell me
what you are looking for, I can probably save you a great deal of trouble.
When the nature of the search began he said a man named Speering had such
articles in his keeping, but he had not bought them, as the lasts were such
queer ones; shortly after this he said he knew nothing about them; but after
diligent search they were found.
Remanded for further evidence.
John Speering was then put to the bar, charged with stealing the lasts and
upper-leathers from Bogg's lodgings, by Mr Sloman, who, on being sworn,
stated, that although Bogg affirmed he had taken the articles to Brains, yet
he was certain Speering had some hand in the business,
Mr. Brain stated on oath that he did not know Speering in this transaction,
and that it was Bogg who brought the articles to his shop as security for the
loan of 2s. 6d. which he was to return as soon as he had finished some work he
said he had in hand.
Speering was discharged.
Robert Bogg recalled and put to the bar. Mr. Brain, on being sworn, stated
again what he had sworn in the last case; and Bogg was committed to take his
trial, but allowed bail.
(Source: "Commercial Journal" newspaper, 27 April 1839, p2)

The Sydney Gazette on Tuesday 9th July 1839 contained the following article:-

"Monday
8th July 1839, before the Chairman and Civil Jury
Robert Bogg was indicted for embezzlement.
The prisoner, who is a shoemaker, was entrusted
with some work to perform by Mr. Slowman,
which he was charged with embezzling. Guilty:
Three calender months to the house of correction."

There was no mention in either report of the Court proceedings of Robert
Bogg's wife or his children. Were his sons Francis and John at that stage with
their mother? Robert's place of residence is referred to as "lodgings", this
may indicate he was not in a normal domestic situation. His circumstances
indicate that he was going through a very unsettling period of time in his
life. Mary Bogg and Thomas Rayner were obviously together prior to the birth
of Mary Jane Rayner on 29th March 1839 at Williams River and remained
together. Was the fact Robert Bogg was due to appear for sentence the reason
why Mary returned to Sydney.

It would appear that Robert Bogg and Mary Bogg separated at some point after
1836. This was not the first time as evidenced by a notice in the Sydney
Gazette on Thursday 29th March 1832 when he advertised his wife had left with
no good reason and he would not be responsible for her debts. (see under Mary
Toucher). Francis and John remained with their father. Mary left with the
three girls, Hannah, Sarah and Eliza Elizabeth. It would appear Mary adopted
the name of Howden and the girls did the same. A later child Mary Jane born in
1839 also adopted the name of Howden, even though the baptism shows her
parents as Thomas and Mary Rayner. When Sarah and Eliza Elizabeth were
baptised the parents were shown as Robert and Mary Howden, occupation of
father, shoemaker.

Some time between 1836 and 1850 Robert (Jnr) and his sons Francis and John
moved to the Sutton Forest Area near Berrima. There is a postal addresss of a
Robert Bogg recorded at Post Office Berrima on 8 Dec 1848, Sutton Forrest on
30 Apr 1850, Berrima on 30 Sep 1850. In 1863 Robert, Francis and John received
land grants at Big Hill Marulan.

Robert Bogg Jnr. remained a bootmaker all his life and people recalled the
boot making equipment always in the home. Robert Bogg died in 1875, aged 78
years, he is described as a Shoemaker, and the cause of death shown was old
age. Details of his parents are not known to his Grandson Francis Bogg, (son
of John Bogg) who registered the death on 5th May, the Undertaker was William
Weywood, the Rev. Way officiated at the Burial which was witnessed by John
McSuller and Neal McCallum. The registration shows he was married when aged
about 25 years in England to Mary Toucher, and spent about 53 years in the
Colony. The issue of the marriage is shown as Francis 50, John 45, 3 girls
living, one girl deceased.The maiden name of his wife Mary is discussed under
Mary Toucher.

There was no headstone in the Marulan cemetery and in recent years Lorna Parr
had a plaque put up commemorating his life. (Some in formation on Robert Bogg
Jnr. supplied by Lorna Parr.)

Additional Notes supplied by Elizabeth Hook.

1836-1875 -
In 1836 Robert & his wife Mary were charged with stealing "one tame fowl" the
property of Thomas Hely. They were seen walking near his Sydney house just
after his fowl went missing & Mr Hely said Mrs Bogg had "the cock under her
apron". The Court found the couple not guilty. Sometime between 1832 & 1850,
Robert Jnr. & family moved to the Sutton Forest area, near Berrima. He
remained a bootmaker all his life, & people recalled the boot-making equipment
always in the home. Robert Bogg Jnr. died of old age, aged 78 on 30 April
1875, at his son John's home, "Bridgey Swamp", Big Hill, near Marulan, NSW.
His wife Mary Bogg (nee Downing or Toucher) had died before him, although no
record has been found. Reference - (some info supplied by Lorna Parr; SRNSW,
Clerk of the Peace - QS Records - Jul 1836 - 4/8468 No. 50)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Wife: Mary TOUCHER #3835 Also known as Mary WOOLSGROVE/HOWDEN died at age: 76
Married: 1825? in London England
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Born: 8 Apr 1808 in Saint Matthew, Bethnal Green, London, ENG 4 (see note 1)
Died: 5 Oct 1884 in Ulmarra, NSW 5
Buried: 7 Oct 1884 in Ulmarra, NSW, AUS 5
Cause of death: Natural decay 5
Emigrated: 17-18th May 1828 on the "Alexander Henry" from London, England (see note 2)
Father:
Mother:
According to senior members of the Bogg family, Mary Bogg sailed for Sydney
Cove aboard the "Alexander Henry" with her two children a month after her
husband Robert Bogg Jnr. sailed aboard the "Boddington".

The "Alexander Henry" sailed from London under Commander Mugridge on 21st
November 1827. The ship was built in Canada, weighing 299 tonns and sailed
with a crew of 16 men. After calling at Cork she continued on her voyage on
14th December 1827 and called into St. Jago on 2nd February 1828 and arrived
in Sydney Cove on 17th-18th May 1828. The ship carried general cargo and
passengers; Captain Hungerford and family, (17 in number) Mr and Mrs Wyatt and
child, Mr. Townsthend, Mr. Ward, Mr. Cohen, Mr. Spyer and 9 steerage
passengers their names not listed. It is assumed the Bogg family were steerage
passengers.
Report of Vessells Arriving signed by James Hayman, Surveyor of Customs,
addressed to The Honourable Colonial Secretrary, A. McLeay.
Reference. Vessells Arriving Register, Report of Arrivals. 4/5198 - 4/5202, Reel 1263.

Mary and her children appear in the 1828 Census as follows:

B1502. Mary Bogg, F26, Came Free, Ship "Alexander Henry", Arrival 1828, Religion P.
B1503. Hannah Bogg, 3 years, Came Free, Ship "Alexander Henry", Arrival 1828.
B1504. Francis Bogg, 2 years, Came Free, Ship "Alexander Henry", Arrival 1828.

The history of Robert and Mary Bogg is set out under Robert Bogg. At some
point their lives become separate. It would appear that Robert Bogg and Mary
Bogg separated after 1836. Francis and John remained with their father and
eventually moved south to Marulan. Mary left with the three girls, Hannah,
Sarah and Eliza Elizabeth.This was not the first time Mary had left her
husband as is shown by a notice in the Sydney Gazette Thursday 29th March
1832:-

"CAUTION

Whereas my wife Mary Bogg has left
her home without any just cause or provocation, I
hereby caution the Public against giving any trust or
credit on my account
Robert Bogg, Bootmaker"

She of course went back because two more children were born and they were
together in 1836 when charged with stealing a chook.
So there is proof she did, and people did, leave each other.

It would appear she adopted the name of Howden and the girls did the same.
Robert Howden, Shoemaker, appears in the Baptismal entry of Sarah Howden in
the Register of the Parish of St. John's Church of England at Parramatta on
30th June 1839. The place of abode of the parents Robert and Mary Howden was
recorded as St. Phillips Sydney, the date of birth is shown as 14th August
1833. The reference to "St. Phillip's" would indicate they resided in the
area of or attended the St. Phillip's Church in Sydney. It could be assumed
that Sarah was born in Sydney.

The Baptismal entry preceding that of Sarah Howden's in the Register at St.
John's Church at Parramatta, on the same date, on the bottom of the prior
page, is that of Mary Jane Rayner, born on 29th March, 1839. Parents are
recorded as Thomas and Mary Rayner, place of abode of parents, Williams River,
occupation of father, Carpenter. Mary Jane also adopted the name of Howden and
uses that name when she is married.

Mary Howden has three more children to Thomas Rayner and they later marry in
1849 at St. Ann's Scots Church at Paterson. Their address is recorded as
Clarence Town. Mary Howden is described as Widow and Thomas Rayner as
Bachelor. Thomas Rayner was in fact previously married to Catherine Biggs in
1828 in Sydney. I have not been able to find a death registration of Catherine
Rayner before 1849. A Catherine Rayner died in Sydney in 1871. (Not
investigated.) Her father is indexed as James, mother as Margaret. Robert Bogg
Junior, "husband" of Mary, did not die until 1875. I have been unable to
locate a marriage under name of Bogg or Howden in England or Australia..

The birth of Eliza Elizabeth Howden is recorded in the Baptismal Register of
the Parish of the Church of Christ at Newcastle on 15th December 1839. The
address of her parents, Robert and Mary Howden, is shown as Clarence Town.
Eliza Elizabeth was born on 19th October 1835. It is assumed she was born in
Sydney as her parents were in Sydney at the time. Robert Bogg and Mary Bogg on
24th June 1836 were committed for trial at the Sydney Quarter Sessions on a
charge of stealing one tame fowl in Sydney on 23rd June 1836. When the matter
came to trial on 12th July 1836 they were found not guilty. Their address is
described as 'late of Sydney'. So in 1836 the Bogg family resided in Sydney.

The Baptismal entry of Mary Jane Rayner records the address of the parents was
Williams River. Note that Mary Jane was known throughout life as Mary Jane
Howden and married as such. It is presumed their address to be Clarence Town
as six months later when Eliza Elizabeth Howden is baptised the address of the
parents is recorded as Clarence Town. As to why "St. Phillip's" is the address
shown when Sarah was baptised at Parramatta, the same time as Mary Jane was
baptised is not known. Perhaps the reasoning was the parents at the time of
Sarah's birth resided in Sydney, whereas Thomas and Mary resided in Clarence
Town when Mary Jane was born. That reasoning could not have been applied when
Eliza Elizabeth was baptised some months later in Clarence Town. Ena Norris in
the Clarence River Pioneer Register records the place of birth of Mary Jane as
being Glen William. Glen William is a place on the Williams River near
Clarence Town. When Mary Howden and Thomas Rayner were married at Paterson in
1849, Mary is described as "Widow" of Clarence Town, and Thomas Rayner as
Bachelor, Carpenter, of Clarence Town.

It would appear in the latter part of 1839 Mary Howden was living in Williams
River/Clarence Town area with Thomas Rayner. The address of Thomas Rayner at
the time of the baptism at Parramatta of Mary Jane was shown as Williams
River. Clarence Town is on the Williams River. As to why Eliza Elizabeth
Howden was baptised in the Newcastle area at Clarence Town three months later
is not known. Perhaps Mary Howden and Thomas Rayner and the children had been
living in Clarence Town area prior to 1839 and the child Eliza had been left
in Williams River/Clarence Town area when they returned to Parramatta at the
time of the Baptisms of Sarah and Mary Jane. Why they returned to Parramatta
is not obvious, perhaps friends/relatives on either side resided at
Parramatta. In the 1828 Census there was an Israel Raynor, aged 58,
certificate of freedom, arriving aboard the "Nile" in 1801, Protestant,
residing at Parramatta. R 0229. (Thomas Rayner, Catherine and Israel all
were recorded as "Raynor") Could there have been a connection with Thomas
Rayner? More likely the reason for the return at that time was the date for
sentence of Robert Bogg on a charge of stealing at the Sydney Quarter
Sessions. (see later). Then of course there was the Baptism of the children.
The first two, Frances and Hannah were Baptised in London as the children of
Robert and Mary Howden. Sarah was now Baptised under ther same name. Mary Jane
however is obviously the child of Thomas Rayner and Mary (Howden) and is
Baptised under that name. Eliza is Baptised a few months later at Williams
River (Clarence Town) as the child of Robert and Mary Howden. All the girls,
including Mary Jane, used the name of Howden and were married under that name.
The children born thereafter to Thomas Raynor and Mary Howden were all reared
under the name of Rayner.

Who is Mary/Toucher/ Woolsgrove/Bogg/Howden/Rayner.

Donna Bailey in her family tree on Rootsweb, and many others linking onto the
same family, consider she is Mary Ann Toucher, daughter to James Toucher and
Sarah (spelt Tioucher) born 8th April 1808 of St. Matthew, Bethnal Green in
London, husband of Robert Bogg Jnr. When Robbert Bogg Jnr. died his death was
registered by Francis Bogg, grandson, son of John Bogg of Bridgey Swamp, and
registered on 5th May 1875 at Goulburn NSW. The spouse of Robert Bogg Jnr. in
his death registration is recorded as Mary Toucher. This is 40 years after the
apparent separation of Mary and Robert, and following apparently no contact
with each others family. According to Elizabeth Cook's book, "Journey to a New
Life", printed in 2000, nothing is known of what happened to Mary and the
three girls. The author was in contact with Lorna Parr, Bogg family historian
and the author of a book on the Bogg family in Australia.

Emma Rayner, daughter of Mary and Thomas Rayner, was married to Robert James
Collie on 11th July 1878 in the Parsonage of the Grafton Methodist Church.
Emma records her mother's name in the church records as being Mary Toulcher.
The entry was sighted by Enid Norris in the Church Archives. This would appear
to confirm that Mary's maiden name was Toucher, Toulcher,or Tioucher. The
surname is recorded down south in the Bogg family when Robert Bogg died in
1875, and in the Rayner family in the north of the state when Emma is married.
The information is given at the end of the life of Robert Bogg Jnr. and near
the end of the life of Mary Rayner. This is not a case of researchers copying
other peoples information or the necessity of continuing a deception.

When Thomas Rayner died at Ulmarra in 1881 his death registration shows his
wife's name as being Mary Bogg. Mary was alive at the time of the death of
Thomas Rayner.

The story is different in the families of the "Howden" girls. When Mary Jane
Howden married William Wingfield she records her mother's maiden name as being
Mary Woolsgrove. No mention is made of a prior marriage or the Bogg name. The
family trees of the "Howden" family, including Sarah Howden, all refer to the
maiden name of Mary as being that of Woolsgrove, and their father as being
Robert Howden. The "Howden family" was also of the opinion that Robert and
Mary Howden came out of the "Caroline" in 1828. That is incorrect. John Hawden
(indexed under Howden) and his wife and children came out on the "Caroline".
This couple are documented in the colony and appear separately in the 1828
census. (See the Notes for further information) The only mention of Bogg
occurs when Thomas Rayner died at Ulmarra in 188l, his wife's name is recorded
in the death registration as Mary Bogg. At the time of Thomas Rayner's death
his wife Mary is still alive. When Mary and Thomas Rayner marry in 1849 Mary's
name is recorded as "Mary Howden". When Mary Rayner died the registration
records "parents unknown".

The names of Woolsgrove and Howden are a part of the name deception carried
out in relation to the girls Hannah, Sarah, Eliza Elizabeth and finally Mary
Jane, who was baptised as the child of Thomas and Mary Rayner. All girls were
married under the name of Howden. The maiden name of "Woolsgrove" was accepted
by the Sarah Howden family. The origin of "Woolsgrove" is not known other than
it is the mothers maiden name recorded by Mary Jane Howden when she married
William Wingfield in Clarence Town in 1858.

Why would Mary Bogg change her name after she apparently separated from Robert
Bogg after 1836 and took with her Hannah, Sarah and Eliza Elizabeth. Looking
at the information of Elizabeth Hook perhaps the situation in Sydney supplies
a few clues. Firstly the police charge in 1836 would threaten her security,
stealing was a very serious offence in the infant colony. The sister of Robert
Bogg Jnr. Eliza, had married very respectably to a solicitor, but prematurely
died in 1835. Possibly Mary would have access to legal advice. Robert's sister
Charlotte left her husband and deserted her children (they apparently went up
for adoption) and whilst "working" at the rocks took a man home and robbed
him. Brother Charles stole from his father (a gold watch) and others, was
convicted and sent to Morton Bay and Port Macquarie. Robert's sister Elizabeth
married George Morris, he became the "black sheep" when he went off the rails
and was charged with assaulting a constable of police. As to why the deception
in regards to Mary's name was carried on in relation to the child Mary Jane is
not clear. Perhaps it was for social reasons or the continuation of a
purported family situation. Mary and Thomas Rayner probably knew each other as
they lived streets from each other in their early years in Sydney. It is
interesting that Sarah and Mary Jane were baptised in Parramatta on 30th June
1839, a week before Robert Bogg was appeared before the Sydney Quarter
Sessions on 7th (or 8th) July 1839, pleaded guilty, and was sentenced to three
months to the house of correction. Was there an agreement between Mary and
Robert Bogg that the girls would be reared as Howden's and the baptisms were
carried out in the name of Howden? This would be consistent with the baptism
of the first two children in London under the name of Howden..

When Mary Rayner died in 1884 her death is registered by Grandson John
Wingfield of Ulmarra. The details of her parents appear as "Not Known".The
Undertaker is James Knox of Ulmarra and the witness to the burial are J.R.
Taylor and W.A. Taylor. The registration states she was born in London, has
spent 55 years in NSW, and she was married to Thomas Rayner, her age at the
time of marriage is not shown. No mention is made of any prior marriage. The
children listed are Hannah 60 years, Sarah 55 years, Elizabeth 49 years
(would refer to Eliza Elizabeth), Emma 40 years, Sopphia 35 years, Thomas 42
years. Reference is made to two males deceased. There is no reference to Mary
Jane born 1839, the mother of John Wingfield, the informant. It is presumed he
was concentating on listing the other children and then omitted his mother.
Reference is made to two males deceased. John Bogg was deceased but Francis
Bogg was not, perhaps there was no contact and it was assumed by the grandson
that both were deceased as he had no knowledge of them. None of the Rayner
children were deceased.

It is most unusual the "Bogg" family south of Sydney had no knowledge of the
existence of the Howden/Rayner family, and the "Howden" family had no
knowledge of the Bogg family, and the Sarah Howden family do not appear to
have knowledge of the "Rayner" family. Mary Howden is indeed a woman of many
question marks. I am of the opinion that any reference to Robert Howden is
actually a reference to Robert Bogg and Robert Howden does not exist. Mary
resumed the name of Howden after her separation from Robert Bogg and that
continued until such time as she adopted the name of Rayner before or on her
marriage to Thomas Rayner in 1849. In the 1828 Census there is a record of a
Samuel Howden, arriving aboard the "Henry" in 1823 and living at Parramatta,
There was also a William Howden arriving aboard the "Prince of Orange" in
1821. Another record of a Robert Howden can be found in the court evidence at
the Old Bailey when Elizabeth Chambers was convicted of stealing his property
in London. Elizabeth arrived aboard the "Kitty" in 1792 and eventually married
Henry Lamb a soldier in the colony.They resided in Parramatta/Windsor area.
Their son Henry married Charlotte Bogg. There could have been a relationship
between Elizabeth Lamb, nee Chambers, and the Bogg Snr./Jnr. families.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
F Child 1: Hannah HOWDEN #6214 Birth name Hannah BOGG died at age: 69
Born: 28 May 1825 in Paddington, England 6,7
Baptized: 28 May 1826 in St. James, Paddington, London UK. 7
Died: 20 Sep 1894 in Stockton, NSW
Husband: Alfred DUMBRELL #6221 b. 17 Aug 1823 d. 10 Mar 1904
Married: 8 Feb 1847 in Clarence Town, NSW 8,6,7
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
M Child 2: Francis BOGG #6222 died at age: 75
Born: c1826 in England
Died: 10 Oct 1901 in Goulburn Hospital, Goulburn, NSW 9,10
Buried: 14 Oct 1901 in C/E Cemetery, Goulburn NSW 9
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
M Child 3: John BOGG #6224 died at age: 49
Born: c1829 in Sydney NSW
Died: 21 Dec 1878 in Bannaby NSW 1,11
Buried: 21 Dec 1878 in C/E Cemetery Marulan, NSW 1
Wife: Eliza S. SPENSER #6308 b. c1828 d. 27 Sep 1875
Married: 1852 in Cobbity, Narellan 12
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
F Child 4: Sarah Jane HOWDEN #3834 Birth name Sarah Jane BOGG died at age: 78
Born: 14 Aug 1833 in Sydney, NSW, AUS 13
Christened: 30 Jun 1839 in St. John's C. of E., Parramatta, NSW, AUS 13 (see note 3)
Died: 18 Sep 1911 in Clarence Town, NSW, AUS (see note 4)
Buried: 19 Sep 1911 in Clarence Town, NSW, AUS
Husband: Henry Walsh GAGGIN #3833 b. 30 Jul 1829 d. 11 Apr 1910
Married: 20 Mar 1851 in C. of E. Clarence Town, NSW, AUS 14 (see note 5)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
F Child 5: Eliza Elizabeth HOWDEN #6225 Birth name Eliza Elizabeth BOGG died at age: 85
Born: 19 Oct 1835 in Sydney NSW. 15
Baptized: 15 Dec 1839 in Clarence Town, Parish C/E Church of Christ, Newcastle NSW 15
Died: 29 Jun 1921 in Wardell NSW.
Buried: at Wardell NSW.
Husband: George WINGFIELD #6334 b. 1823 d. 15 Aug 1859
Married: 3 Mar 1852 in Clarence Town NSW. 16
Husband: George Johnson LEESON #6335
Married: 22 Oct 1862 in Clarence River NSW
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
F Child 6: Mary Jane HOWDEN #6226 Birth name Mary Jane RAYNER died at age: 57
Born: 29 Mar 1839 in William's River, NSW 17,18
Baptized: 30 Jun 1839 in St. John's C/E Church Parramatta NSW 17
Died: 24 Jun 1896 in Ulmarra NSW
Husband: William Wingfield #6317 b. 24 Feb 1834 d. 23 May 1911
Married: 13 Jun 1858 in Irish Town NSW (near Clarence Town) 19
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
(1) Burial Index C/E Church Marulan NSW Died at Bannaby 21 Dec 1878.
(2) BDM 1875/6250 Death Reg. Goulburn NSW Robert Bogg. No Parents shown.
(3) C/E Parish Register AH AGSC Y1/CR.
(4) Christening Records St. Matthew, Bethnal Green, London England. IGI C046983, 0855939.
Film 6900605.
(5) BDM 1884/07732. Death Reg. Ulmarra NSW. Mary Rayner aged 79 years, no parent details.
Name before marriage was given as Mary Bogg.
(6) donnabailey77@hotmail.com Roots Webb WorldConnect.
(7) Gwenneth J. Marsden. 48 Northolt Road, Fairview Downs, Hamilton N.Z. 3214. LDS.
Pedigree Res. File. Com. Disk 136.
(8) BDM V1847 447 32C MA. Reel 5010. Marriage Reg. C/E Dungog NSW. Alfred Dumbrell and
Anna Howden.
(9) Burial Index C/E Goulburn, County Argyle 14-10-1901 Francis Bogg, aged 74 years.
(10) BDM 1901/13556 Death Reg. Goulburn NSW Francis Bogg. Index shows Father Robert,
Mother Eliza.
(11) BDM 1878/6033 Death Reg. Goulburn NSW.
aged 49 years, Father Robert, Mother Mary.
(12) BDM V1852 462 38C. Marriage Reg. Cobbity, Narellan NSW, V1852 482 38C Reg. Berrima.
Robert Bogg and Mary A. Spencer.
(13) BDM V1833 673 23A Reel 5005 Baptism of Sarah Howden at St. John's Parramatta. Place
of abode given as St. Phillip's Sydney. Parents Robert and Mary Howden The prior Baptism
on the prior page was that of Mary Jane Rayner, parents Thomas and Mary Rayner, address
Williams River.
(14) BDM V1851 1773 159 ML. Marriage Reg. Clarence Town NSW. Henry Walsh Gaggin and Sarah
Howden.
(15) BDM V1835 1325 23A Reel 5005. Bapism Eliza Elizabeth Howden, C/E Register Church of
Christ Newcastle. Place of abode given as Clarence Town NSW, Parents Robert and Mary
Howden.
(16) BDM V1852 855 38C. MA. Reel 5013. Marriage Reg. Dungog NSW. George Wingfield and
Eliza E. Howden.
(17) BDM V1839 672 23A Reel 5005. Baptism St. John's C/E Church, Parramatta. Mary Jane
RAYNER. Parents Thomas and Mary Rayner of William's River. Next Baptism was that of Sarah
Howden on same day, same church.
(18) Family sources say Mary Jane was born at William's River.
(19) BDM 1858. Registrar General Marriage Register and Indexes do not have a record of the
marriage. However, there is a record/notation that the marriage took place. Marriage
details copied from original church records for the District of Dungog and Maitland.
William Wingfield and Mary Jane Howden.

Note 1 I consider there is no doubt that Mary's name prior to marriage was Toucher.
(variation of spellings ?). Ena Norris sighted the church record in the
archives of the marriage of Emma Rayner to Robert James Collie on 11 July
1878 at Grafton, in that record the maiden name of the mother is recorded as
being Mary Toulcher. When Robert Bogg Snr dies the maiden name of the wife is
shown as Mary Toucher. When Thomas Rayner died in 1881 in Ulmarra the name of
the wife is recorded as Mary Bogg. These three entries, separated by over 1000
K/M in two different worlds you might say and by two separated families surely
must confirm Toucher. The death certificate of Robert Bogg Jnr does not record
the names of the girls, just three girls living, one girl deceased. It records
the boys Francis 50, and John 45. The death registration of Thomas Rayner
records 1 male, 6 girls, all living. No mention of a prior marriage of either.
When Mary dies the children are recorded as Hannah 60, Sarah 55, Elizabeth 49
(Would be Eliza Elizabeth), Emma 40, Sophia 35, Thomas 42. 2 males deceased.
Mary Jane was missed obviously by the grandson registering the death. No
mention is made of a first marriage or prior husbands. Age at marriage of Mary
and Thomas not shown in both their death registrations.
Note 2 The family of Mr and Mrs Hawden arrived in Sydney as cabin passengers on 12th
September 1828 aboard the "Caroline". The ship left London on 19th April 1828
carrying general cargo and passengers in cabin and steerage. According to the
report of the Surveyor of Customs of ships arriving in Port Jackson they were
accompanied by two male children under the age of 12 years. Ref. 4/4823, Reel
1383. Mr. Hawden was described as a settler. The family is indexed under
Howden.
The Ships Register records details of persons in Sydney aboard the "Caroline"
on 12th September 1828. Included are a Mr and Mrs Hawden, cabin passengers,
described as settler. There is no reference to children in this record. Ref.
4/5199, Reel 1283.
The 1828 Census records the family :-
"Hawdon - John, 27 years, came free, "Caroline" 1828, Protestant, Landholder,
residing at "Elderslie" Upper Minto. Ref. H1035.
Hawdon - Mrs., 26 years, came free, "Caroline", 1828, Protestant. Ref. H1036.
Hawdon - John Jnr., 1 year, came free, "Caroline", Protestant. Ref. H1037.
There was no reference to the second child.
John's brother, Joseph Hawdon, 1813-1871 joined him in 1834 and settled at
Burgalia, near Batemans Bay. Ref. Australian Dictionary of Biography on line
edition.
Lancelot Sanderson also travelled on the "Caroline" and later worked for John
Hawdon at Elderslie. See the 1828 Census and the family history of Lancelot
Sanderson www.sanderson.asn.au
Many family researchers in our family believed that the Mary Howden and Robert
Howden, parents of Sarah Howden and Eliza Howden, came to Australia aboard the
"Caroline". That is not supported by the record of the "Caroline" and the 1828
Census. Both the cabin and steerage passengers are detailed in the records of
the entry of the ship into Sydney. The 1839 NSW Directory lists John Hawdon,
J.P., Bergally, Braidwood. Both John and Joseph Hawdon appear in the Port
Phillip Directory in 1847. John, settler at Gippsland and Joseph, Settler,
Tallarook, Goulburn.
Note 3 NSW State Archives Entry 673/678 Volume 23
Minister: Richard Taylor.
Note 4 NSW BDM Reference 1911 9680
Note 5 The witnesses were Alfred Dumbrill and Mary McPhie. NSW State Archives Entry 1773 Volume 159

Robert married Mary TOUCHER (DOWNING) [16757] [MRIN: 6006] about 1825 in England. (Mary TOUCHER (DOWNING) [16757] was born on 8 Apr 1808 in St Mathew Bethnal Green LND, died on 5 Oct 1884 in Ulmarra NSW and was buried on 7 Oct 1884 in Ulmarra NSW.)